(22:34:35) steve: I've decided to do that wiki project over the summer. (22:34:46) steve: It will be a experience of the learning kind. (22:35:10) msn: ok (22:35:18) msn: can you forward me the email (22:35:31) steve: The email you sent me long ago? (22:35:56) msn: well (22:36:02) msn: what was the wiki idea (22:36:05) msn: wiki w/ RSS? (22:36:09) msn: Recursive Wiki? (22:36:20) steve: Wiki with RSS and image uploading (22:36:23) msn: Ok (22:36:29) msn: Lets add recursive nodes to it too (22:36:53) steve: How would recursive nodes work? (22:36:59) msn: + blogging/news -- ;) maybe (22:37:03) steve: Links to other nodes in the wiki? (22:37:15) msn: Recusrive Nodes are like says [embed:node1] so node1 is printed (22:37:16) steve: Like that Wikincyclopedia (22:37:22) steve: oh, I see. (22:37:24) msn: It's like a textlink (22:37:30) msn: instead of a hyperlink (22:37:39) steve: I see. (22:37:40) msn: so you can compose pages using subnodes (22:37:42) msn: cool eh? (22:37:45) steve: Yeah. (22:37:52) steve: Could be very cool. (22:38:16) steve: [insert formating-fancy] (22:38:28) steve: [insert text-main_page] (22:38:31) steve: hmmm (22:38:32) msn: yes (22:38:39) msn: Or have 1 page of nice HTML (22:38:41) msn: w/ the embed :) (22:39:01) msn: you'd be surprised how easy it is (22:39:08) msn: the only problem is cyclic inclusion (22:39:09) msn: e.g. (22:39:11) msn: a->b (22:39:13) msn: b->a (22:39:32) steve: right (22:39:43) steve: I'd have to have the nodes be checked for that (22:39:51) msn: yah (22:39:55) msn: it's easy to check (22:39:58) steve: This would be done with PHP, right? (22:40:06) msn: I'd prefer perl (22:40:10) msn: but if necessary (22:40:12) msn: php (22:40:12) steve: Alright (22:40:20) msn: If you want reasonable tech support (22:40:21) msn: do perl (22:40:22) steve: I just have some experience with PHP (22:40:27) steve: PHP is really nice (22:40:40) steve: but I can learn perl (22:40:53) msn: The reason why perl would be good (22:40:57) msn: is that perl can run as the user (22:41:01) msn: php runs as www (22:41:09) msn: so anyone can alter your files if www can edit them (22:42:11) steve: ah (22:42:13) steve: Okay. (22:45:22) msn: http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=286908139#post286908139 (22:46:37) steve: Alright. (22:48:00) steve: How would you recommend I go about learnng perl? (22:48:16) msn: do you run linux or have a box that runs linux? (22:48:26) msn: otherwise did you ever use PHP locally (22:48:54) steve: I don't have a linux box, no (22:49:12) steve: The PHP project I did was run on a computer I was using at school that did have Linux. (22:49:49) steve: (I should learn how to use Linux well anyways, so I could install it on my computer here as a double-boot) (22:51:22) msn: I can give you access (22:51:49) steve: That would be good. (22:51:57) msn: but that isnt important right now (22:52:02) msn: we're gonna do this right (22:52:11) steve: That would be the best way to do it. (22:52:16) msn: now when developping software what comes first (22:52:40) steve: designing requirments? (22:52:53) msn: reqs and then design (22:52:59) msn: http://abez.ca/~abez/wiki/index.cgi?SteveSecretSection (22:53:31) msn: Ok (22:53:35) msn: that's a public wiki (22:53:42) msn: but what we'll do will be opensource anyways (22:53:45) steve: Right. (22:54:06) msn: One can add nodes and write requirements there (22:54:10) msn: I think that's a good spot (22:54:15) msn: and allows us to be informal (22:54:34) msn: we arent going to be really formal here (22:54:37) msn: we dont need to be (22:54:38) steve: Right (22:55:18) steve: So do we post up what we think we need? (22:57:33) msn: Reload (22:57:39) msn: basically (22:57:48) msn: So we want no database (22:57:56) steve: We don't? (22:58:09) msn: You don't need it (22:58:13) steve: Okay. (22:58:23) steve: We would store the stuff in files, then? (22:58:27) msn: yep (22:58:31) msn: that's why I suggest perl (22:58:38) msn: otherwise everyone can muck w/ the files (22:58:50) steve: Okay. (23:01:03) steve: Usability, of course (23:01:23) msn: http://abez.ca/~abez/wiki/index.cgi?WikiRequirements& (23:01:28) msn: Click there (23:01:30) msn: before you reload (23:01:36) msn: you keep posting over my stuff :) (23:01:42) steve: Sorry. (23:01:56) steve: Okay. (23:02:01) steve: What is Race Condition? (23:02:16) msn: For the links is [Node Name|Link Label] good? or Should it just be [Node Name] (23:02:17) steve: Oooooh,,, what was just happening? (23:02:21) msn: Yes (23:02:24) msn: That's a race condition (23:02:53) steve: I support [Node Name|Link Label] (23:03:15) msn: we need things for quote, bold, italic, (23:03:27) steve: Because it's nice to have the option of specifying the label, and we can set it up so that it shows the name if a label is absent (23:03:31) msn: maybe almost copy vb code.. (23:03:42) steve: Yeah, vb code has pretty much what we want. (23:04:08) msn: I dont like how vb code handles arguements (23:04:14) msn: but if we keep it simple (23:04:17) msn: we'll be fine (23:04:26) steve: rightio (23:04:37) msn: vbcode is nice because you dont really need a full parser (23:04:47) msn: you can search an replace certain things (23:04:52) steve: Right. (23:04:57) msn: I for one care little about HTML correctness (23:05:03) msn: but (23:05:13) msn: I want to make sure that we need minimal html (23:05:15) steve: It's good to have. (23:05:18) msn: in writing wiki pages (23:05:22) msn: it's good to have (23:05:23) msn: yes (23:05:33) msn: but writing a wiki page should be virtually formatting free (23:05:40) msn: as in I dont care about formatting (23:05:45) msn: and html shouldn't be in the way (23:05:51) steve: right (23:06:06) steve: For images, what if they were uploaded and treated as a node? (23:06:11) msn: awesome idea (23:06:23) steve: and then to insert them, you'd just use a [node name] thing? (23:06:42) msn: that's pretty simple way of doing it (23:07:05) steve: I suppose. (23:07:16) steve: What would be a better way? (23:07:55) msn: images handled seperatly and differently is an alternative way (23:07:59) msn: but I link that way (23:08:03) msn: makes it very easy (23:08:15) msn: the node link just needs to be clear (23:08:21) steve: Yeah (23:08:21) msn: cause if we're doing vbcode (23:08:34) msn: [b] is b node or bold you know :) (23:08:49) steve: [imagenode name|title text], maybe? (23:08:55) msn: yah (23:09:11) msn: hmmm (23:09:13) msn: actually (23:09:14) steve: Alright. (23:09:30) msn: it's ok to use vbcode and the [nodename] (23:09:32) msn: semantics (23:09:43) msn: cause [b] and other stuff could simply be primitives (23:09:52) msn: primitive nodes (23:09:53) steve: Yeah, I see what you mean. (23:10:02) msn: at the very least conceptually (23:10:06) steve: oh, wait (23:10:14) steve: I really got what you mean now. (23:10:33) steve: We could create an entire set of HTML tags using that system (23:10:51) msn: well more like markup (23:10:53) steve: Create all kinds of basic stuff, lock it so it can't be altered (23:11:04) steve: Be like lego. (23:11:07) msn: yah one file which contains the basic ones (23:11:13) msn: and then the others are a little more complex (23:11:22) msn: it'll flow in implementation don't worry :) (23:11:24) steve: Right. (23:11:34) msn: but the solution might be really clean (23:11:47) msn: RSS is a concern (23:11:55) steve: Yeah, I don't know much about that. (23:12:02) msn: We could limit RSS to "news pages" (23:12:40) msn: Basically when nodes are added either the RSS is updated or when news nodes are added RSS is updated (23:12:40) steve: Yeah, good idea. (23:13:05) msn: So a news page should be an automated system of node creation and cycling.